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Tracy

Growing up, I was raised in a strict Baptist environment.
As I got older and had more life experiences, the precepts that I new as a youth began to change based upon my dealings with the real world.
But I have several friends that are still locked into their religious beliefs, thinking it is the right way that all should live by. They are not open to discussion on why others may choose to live in another way, and sadly many of them have a tendency to look down on others that don't believe as they do, even though the doctrine they espouse tells them they should do otherwise.
I find it strange that they refuse to acknowledge that there might be other beliefs that others abide by.

Texas Redneck

If the users here will use self control it should not be an issue.
And if/when the site grows, it has the ability for users to use self moderation to upvote/downvote posts, which hopefully will also help.

Tracy

Mythtaken said in When is freedom of speech not free?:

Here in the Great White North, we do limit free speech when that speech promotes or incites violence or genocide against "a defined racial, ethnic, gender, sexual, religious or other identifiable group" which I think is a reasonable limitation.

Actually, the Constitution for the US makes no clarifications on that... but the judicial process does, which is what interprets our Constitution - depending on the political leanings of the majority of the justices now.

Just the feeling of fear or the feeling of being intimidated is not enough to me. But if you are actively calling for/promoting violence against others, then that is perfectly legitimate.
It's where you get into prosecuting people for saying stuff like "I don't want a <fill in the blank here> living in my neighborhood because they are trashy and bring my property value down and they worship a false God" that I have problems with. And that is happening and being pushed by certain people with what I think of as a tilted outlook.

Mythtaken said in When is freedom of speech not free?:

Based on some of the things I've seen going on in America this last while, I'd say there are quite a few on the religious right who are against any mention of sex altogether

If you do anything other than missionary style, you are a sinner! We all know the good book teaches that sex is only for procreation and not enjoyment!
Let's ignore Proverbs 5:18-19

and rejoice in the wife of your youth, a lovely deer, a graceful doe. May her breasts satisfy you at all times, may you be intoxicated always by her love

There are always extremist that bring their own thoughts (usually from their upbringing) into play.
That was sort of the reason of the creation of this site. Many peoples attitudes/outlooks are based upon their environment. Sadly, some of them refuse to look at facts that might disagree with their ingrained thoughts.

As for the restriction of religious items in the work place, I have no issues with that either. I agree that display of religious items in a government facility is tantamount to supporting religion.

Tracy

Mythtaken said in When is freedom of speech not free?:

It's also a fact that many of the people who are most vocal about free speech interpret it to mean "free for me, but not for thee".

Yes, and I see this regularly here in the United States. Classic case is the theory that LGBTQ books are "bad" for school libraries because they talk about sex (what the certain religious types consider unnatural sex acts) yet they are gleefully happy to allow the Christian Bible (sorry, that nasty Quran is not allowed because it is the religion of those heathen Muslims) in the school library, totally ignoring the fact that it has the same type of items in it that they yell about in the other books.

Mythtaken said in When is freedom of speech not free?:

And, of course, America's version of free speech is different from that in a lot of other countries, where governments have put limits on what can be said if it is deemed harmful to some other group.

This is being attempted even here in some states. It's like we are entering the era of the "thought police" and restrictions of what can be said.
I do agree that there are some things that are not allowed, like the classic case of shouting "Fire" in a crowded theater or threatening to blow up a building. Things that can cause the fear of or threat of actual physical injury can generally be controlled through legislative means. But outlawing the ability of people to talk in a derogatory manner about others is taking it to the extreme. Hurt feelings are not a place that government needs to be doing legislating in.

Tracy

I have a feeling we will be in for them here if the site takes off.
I am afraid that most will not want to discuss the ideology behind their thoughts on the fields, but more their zealotry, conflating the two.

Texas Redneck

We hear people yelling all the time about being censored and their "freedom of speech" being impinged upon.
Sadly, many of these are politicians holding high government offices. Of all people, they should know that freedom of speech is only protected from government restrictions, the thing that they are a part of. Business, individuals and similar are not required to abide by those same rules the government is.
They have they should always have the ability to control who they serve and what they allow in their establishments.
I realize that this might offend people that want to go there. But we rarely get what we want in life. If the rules that a business have are that bad, then people will vote with their feet and the income of the business will start to hurt.
But to think that you should be able to force your beliefs upon others as a customer is what many would consider self-centered.

Texas Redneck

ideology
noun [ C or U ]
us /ˌaɪ.diˈɑː.lə.dʒi/ uk /ˌaɪ.diˈɒl.ə.dʒi/
a set of beliefs or principles, especially one on which a political system, party, or organization is based:
socialist/capitalist ideology
The people are caught between two opposing ideologies.

This is a place for those to come together to discuss in an adult manner the differences in beliefs of people, both political and religious in nature. Open discourse is encouraged. Flaming, threatening and similar behavior is not and will not be tolerated.

For those that are not familiar with the, the term "ideology" and the system of ideas associated with it were developed in 1796 by Antoine Destutt de Tracy (1754-1836), who crystalized his ideas while in prison (November 1793 to October 1794) pending trial during the Reign of Terror of c. 1793 to July 1794.

Hoping to form a secure foundation for the moral and political sciences, Tracy devised the term for a "science of ideas", basing such upon two things: (1) the sensations that people experience as they interact with the material world; and (2) the ideas that form in their minds due to those sensations. Tracy conceived of ideology as a liberal philosophy that would defend individual liberty, property, free markets, and constitutional limits on state power.

There is the expectation that participants here will have rather thick skin. If you cannot take being confronted and being asked to justify your position, then this site is probably not the safe zone you are looking for.

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